Beyond The Ice Wall Speculation?

Jul 3, 2015 0:47:46 GMT zarlodious said:
If the equator is 24,000 miles in circumference this would mean that the ice wall of Antarctica is approximately 75,000 miles in circumference. This is hardly 100% patrolable and I think like in many cases it is fear holding us back. Instead of 1 crew of 10 people it should be 10 crews of 1-2 people all at the same time. Unfortunately like many of us time and money are holding us back, maybe start an FE lottery pool or something to make this happen?

Jul 4, 2015 10:49:58 GMT gnosticwarrior said:

We've seen some crazy views; why not position one closer to the area? Is that even possible?

Just thinking as I have my coffee this morning...

Jul 4, 2015 11:04:14 GMT thinkforyourself said:
Jul 4, 2015 10:49:58 GMT gnosticwarrior said:


I also had another idea. Seeing as telescopes can see as far as other 'planets' like Jupiter, would it not be possible to use a telescope from a high point to try and see what the Arctic and Antarctic Rim look like? 

Jul 4, 2015 11:50:26 GMT gnosticwarrior said:
I too was thinking of something like this! The only inhibitor would be atmospheric distortion of some type, as is a similar reason to why we can't see Europe from Boston etc.

Now - what if we combined both approaches, and fitted a high-altitude balloon with some sort of powerful zoom-equipped camera, that had the power of a telescope from that high of a vantage point...?

Jul 4, 2015 11:50:26 GMT gnosticwarrior said:
Jul 4, 2015 11:04:14 GMT thinkforyourself said:
That is a very good idea. 

I also had another idea. Seeing as telescopes can see as far as other 'planets' like Jupiter, would it not be possible to use a telescope from a high point to try and see what the Arctic and Antarctic Rim look like? 

I too was thinking of something like this! The only inhibitor would be atmospheric distortion of some type, as is a similar reason to why we can't see Europe from Boston etc.

Now - what if we combined both approaches, and fitted a high-altitude balloon with some sort of powerful zoom-equipped camera, that had the power of a telescope from that high of a vantage point...?

EDIT: unless that's what you were already speaking of, thinkforyourself! The coffee is still kicking in, lol.

Jul 4, 2015 13:57:40 GMT thinkforyourself said:
Jul 4, 2015 11:50:26 GMT gnosticwarrior said:
I too was thinking of something like this! The only inhibitor would be atmospheric distortion of some type, as is a similar reason to why we can't see Europe from Boston etc.

Now - what if we combined both approaches, and fitted a high-altitude balloon with some sort of powerful zoom-equipped camera, that had the power of a telescope from that high of a vantage point...?

EDIT: unless that's what you were already speaking of, thinkforyourself! The coffee is still kicking in, lol.

Combining both approaches is a very good idea, and could potentially lead to some brilliant results. I wonder how much it would cost to make that achievable? 

Jul 4, 2015 16:03:30 GMT techy said:
Jul 4, 2015 13:57:40 GMT thinkforyourself said:
Combining both approaches is a very good idea, and could potentially lead to some brilliant results. I wonder how much it would cost to make that achievable? 

If you could operate the zoom wireless maybe, and come up with a stabilizer of some kind so the camera is not jostling around up there, I know they make stabilizers for filming on the ground.

Jul 4, 2015 16:03:30 GMT techy said:
Jul 4, 2015 13:57:40 GMT thinkforyourself said:
Combining both approaches is a very good idea, and could potentially lead to some brilliant results. I wonder how much it would cost to make that achievable? 

If you could operate the zoom wireless maybe, and come up with a stabilizer of some kind so the camera is not jostling around up there, I know they make stabilizers for filming on the ground.

Jul 4, 2015 16:15:31 GMT gnosticwarrior said:
Jul 4, 2015 16:03:30 GMT techy said:
If you could operate the zoom wireless maybe, and come up with a stabilizer of some kind so the camera is not jostling around up there, I know they make stabilizers for filming on the ground.

That's what I'm thinking; some sort of remote device that allows for control of stabilization and zoom. 

Have you guys seen those standalone cameras that people use to film themselves surfing from the shore, etc? 

Doesn't require an operator at all...I wonder if that's a viable option for something like this? The issue would then be the zoom, of course. A few different cameras mounted at once could be a very unique view, as well.

You could cut to and from cameras, which would make for some awesome post-editing proofs for people saying "it's the lens" etc.

Perhaps you could add propulsion to the balloon, it would be a remote controlled blimp.
^^^^^It's crazy enough, it just might work ^^^^^^^^^

Jul 4, 2015 16:45:59 GMT techy said:
www.highaltitudescience.com/products/eagle-pro-near-space-kit

Heres one with all kinds of bells and whistles  

Features



Eagle Flight Computer - our robust flight computer records data such as temperature, pressure, altitude, wind speed, GPS coordinates, etc. to a micro SD card for post-mission analysis. Unlike most GPS receivers that cut out at 18,000 m ~ 60,000 ft, the GPS receiver on our flight computer will work up to 80,000 m ~ 260,000 ft!

Delta Flight Frame - our American Basswood frame is designed to be as light and strong as carbon fiber at a fraction of the cost. It forms the rugged backbone to which all the flight hardware is attached. Its unique design makes it very stable platform for getting great footage from the edge of space.

Camera Mount - securely fastens any camera of your choice to the Delta Flight Frame. If you would like to mount multiple cameras, purchase our Universal Camera Mount Kits.

Weather Balloon - these high quality weather balloons ensure you reach record breaking altitudes. You have the option of selecting any size weather balloon we carry when purchasing this kit. Our 350 g Weather Balloon is our most popular. The 600 g Weather Balloon is for those who want to ensure they break 100,000 ft. If this is your first launch, we do not recommend using our 1200 g Weather Balloon.

1.0 m Near Space Parachute - Our parachutes are designed specifically for near-space flights and manufactured right here in the US by a company that specializes in manufacturing parachutes for defense contracts.

Weather Balloon Inflator - the safest inflation system available on the market. It has a built in gas pressure regulator and gas filter to make sure that you are safely filling your balloon with nothing but pure helium gas.

Spot Trace Satellite Tracker - the most robust and reliable tracking solution for high altitude balloon flights. This exceptional piece of hardware communicates directly with satellites in orbit allowing you to track your payload just about anywhere on (or off) the planet. A $100 annual service subscription is required. Visit www.findmespot.com for details.

Eagle Flight Manual - a thirty page full-color manual that teaches you everything you need to know to successfully launch a mission to the edge of space and recover your payload every time.

Jul 4, 2015 17:54:39 GMT techy said:
www.stratostar.net/faq.html
 Link to some frequently asked questions about weather balloons looks like some good information. Like how to fill, how high will one go and things like that.

Excellent! Thank you for posting this link!


How much weight can I fly on a high altitude weather balloon?
In the United States, regulations permit flights carrying up to 12 lbs (5.4 kg) total payload, not including the weight of the balloon itself. This weight must be divided into separate payload packages no more than 6 lb (2.7 kg) in weight. Since payload can experience violent turbulence in the jet stream, StratoStar has designed lightweight, rugged payload packages that resist damage and ensure the safe return of any equipment used in a flight.

If I understand this correctly, there is a certain weight limit, and must be distributed evenly. This would absolutely be taken into account.

What are the government guidelines for high altitude weather balloons?
In the United States, there are two sets of regulations governing launching and tracking high-altitude weather balloons. One is from the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) and the other is from the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA). All of StratoStar's products are designed to meet the United States Regulations, and we explore these regulations in detail during training. Here's a quick summary of each regulation that applies to our flights:

1. Cell Phones are not permitted to track high-altitude weather balloons in flight.
2. Payloads cannot exceed a package weight/size ratio of three ounces per square inch. *
3. No payload package can exceed 6 lb in weight.
4. Entire weight of all payloads cannot exceed 12 lb in total weight (Excludes weight of balloon).
5. No rope or cable should be used which requires more than 50lb of force to separate payload packages from balloon.
6. No one may launch a high-altitude weather balloon which creates a hazard to other people and property. (i.e. Incorrect parachute, faulty rigging, inappropriate launch location)
7. No one may use a high-altitude weather balloon to drop objects (i.e. gliders and projectiles).
* Determined by dividing total package weight by the area in square inches of the smallest surface.

More regulation, but I think it would be possible to work within these limits and still have a successful experiment. The logistics would then come down to camera weight, mounting weight, any additional gear and equipment, etc.


How high will my high altitude weather balloon balloon go?
The highest recorded gas filled balloon reached 173,000 ft (53 km), launched in 2002 from Japan! However, this was not a normal weather balloon, but a specially designed balloon with a material which is 1/6 the thickness of a plastic grocery bag. The highest recorded weather balloon flight of one of StratoStar's customers is 125,200 ft (38 km) launched by DePauw University launch August 11, 2011 from Illinois. Average weather balloon flights reach 60,000 to 105,000 ft. Watch this video of a weather balloon which reached 110,000 ft over Wyoming launched by a StratoStar Customer.

Must...acquire...magical Japanese balloon material...  

Here's a link for helium vs hydrogen etc. for using in balloons, this might well help get it up, up and away.  

www.chem.hawaii.edu/uham/lift.html


Snip:                                                                                      Hydrogen

These early balloons used hydrogen. While atomic hydrogen is only one fourth the weight of atomic helium, hydrogen forms a diatomic molecule as a gas, and thus has a molecular weight of half of helium, reducing the lift advantage. Since hydrogen is explosive in mixtures with air of more than 4 percent, it is a great fire hazard and serious explosion hazard in large quantities. Helium being an inert gas does not form a diatomic molecule as a gas. Thus hydrogen is only half the weight of helium, not one fourth as you might suspect by looking it up on a periodic table. H2 = 2 * Atomic Weight 1; vs He = 1 * Atomic Weight 4.

Hydrogen is easily manufactured by several chemical reactions such as the action of hydrochloric acid on mossy zinc metal and the action of sodium hydroxide on aluminum metal pellets or punchings. This ability to make the gas on the spot has always been attractive. During the civil war special wagons with large wooden tanks full of acid were used to generate the inflation hydrogen required on the spot. 

The link even has lift tables  It's all about balloon lift with lighter than air gases.

Jul 12, 2015 14:33:39 GMT arctura said:
Oh, I sure think plenty of this was acting. There's one part where they narrowly avoid danger, and the pilot turns around and gives the "thumbs up" to the cameraman. Who does that?  Those parts showing the sailors shoring up the sub's hull could have been from some Navy damage control film.